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Offline creditfarmer

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Bounty Hunter Options 101
« on: 02-02-17, 11:03:37 »
Are you thinking about playing a Bounty Hunter?

 
--- Screen Shots are from Stella Bellum - Red Dwarf TC February 2017---

I am not the most talented at this profession nor have I ever made such a claim.  That is not what this thread is about.   I have played the profession in all its forms and it is my favorite class in the NGE.  The resources available online for NGE Bounty Hunters, seem to be scarce and much of what you find contains broken links. 

Whatever talent I lack in this profession has been buttressed by the shear amount of time I've put into the class; the practice of mock hunting guild members to finally get it right, the patience learned in pursuit of player bounties, the recognition of a miscalculation by the mark and knowing how to efficiently exploit that mishap and finally, the humility of knowing the inside of most of the galaxy's cloners.

This will be a work in progress thread that will be amended as other suggestions to builds, expertise, gear and strategy make their way in.  Also, I'm getting old and my eyesight is bad so my pictures will be big.  Deal with it.

I. Let's start at the beginning


Figure 1. Rodian Bounty Hunter at 0 Skill Points


The Bounty Hunter Profession offers attribute bonuses distributed as follows:
+40 Strength, +80 Constitution, +80 Stamina, +60 Precision, +80 Agility, +20 Luck

---Be careful not confuse the weight of these bonuses with what is actually required by the Combat System to gain advantages in any skirmish.---

The Bounty Hunter's primary attributes by Profession Weight are Constitution +80, Stamina +80 & Agility +80.  These three stats are functionally defensive\sustain in game & help keep you alive but won't win you a fight.  Stacking Constitution or Stamina in your suit produces the least amount of Combat Benefits because they both only contribute to Health and Action pools.
 
+100 Constitution = +800 Health & +200 Action
     

+100 Stamina = +800 Action & +200 Health

Stacking Agility in your suit helps Dodge and Evasion for Ranged and Melee attacks against you.  Agility also helps Parry which is a melee defense against melee attacks against you.  The only exception to this is that light sabers can Parry both Ranged and Melee attacks.

+100 Agility = 0.01% Dodge Chance, 0.01% Evasion Chance & 0.005% Parry Chance

Your secondary attributes by Profession Weight are Precision +60, Strength +40 & Luck +20.  These three stats are functionally offensive in game and determine your lethality.  These three attributes produce the most amount of offensive Combat Benefits and are often heavily stacked in armor suits.

+100 Precision = 0.005% Block Chance, 0.01% Critical Chance, 0.005% Strikethrough Chance & 0.005% Parry Chance

+100 Strength = 0.005% Block Chance, 75 Block Value, 0.01% To Hit & 0.01% Melee Bonus

+100 Luck = 0.0033% Dodge Chance, 0.0033% Evasion Chance, 0.10% Evasion Value, 0.0033% Critical Chance, 0.005% Strikethrough Chance & 0.10% Strikethrough Value

Understanding how combat is calculated can help with your choices in which attributes you stack in your suit.  Fortunately, there is source material available and regarded to be fairly accurate in BadgerSmaker's guides and MasterCosmo's charts which you can digest here: https://forums.stellabellum.net/index.php?topic=593.msg12933;boardseen#new   
-Thanks to Croawen for unearthing it!



II. Which Species is right for me?

The species attribute modifiers are arguably negligible when fully buffed for a hunt and species special abilities were removed for the NGE.  Synergy efforts can still be made.  Your species selection will not determine your overall success rate.

Trandoshan Species: +50 Strength, +65 Constitution, +65 Stamina, +20 Agility
Twi'lek Species: +60 Stamina, +40 Precision, +60 Agility, +40 Luck
Sullstan Species: +40 Strength, +60 Constitution, +60 Agility, +40 Luck
Wookie Species: +85 Strength, +85 Constitution, +40 Stamina, +10 Precision
Zabrack Species: +50 Strength, +50 Constitution, +50 Precision, +50 Agility
Mon Calamari Species: +40 Constitution, +60 Stamina, +60 Precision, +40 Luck
Ithorian Species: +60 Strength, +70 Stamina, +40 Precision, +30 Luck
Human Species: +50 Strength, +50 Stamina, +50 Precision, +50 Agility
Bothan Species: +25 Constitution, +65 Precision, +50 Agility, +60 Luck
Rodian Species: +20 Stamina, +80 Precision, +80 Agility, +20 Luck



III. Expertise Options Tree:

For content's sake, I will be posting my flavor of the month Carbineer build in the following segment not because it is better or worse than a Rifleman build, but to use as an example for skill point allocation and will begin to illustrate why I've selected those skills for my particular play style.  Melee Bounty Hunter is just not a viable option for anything more than toe to toe dueling, PVE and giggles.  Every other profession will out-class you without your Ranged Attacks. 




Figure 2.  19 Skill points used

Bounty Specialization Tree:
Spending too many points in the Bounty Specialization Tree can leave your tool box a little light in the Bounty Hunting Tree.  If you hunt with a rifle, the Rifle line is required.  If you hunt with a Pistol or a Carbine, the Pistol\Carbine line is required.  There are valuable skills here but in my opinion, the Bounty Hunting Tree below is a better host of situational and timing skills.  I play a Carbineer and believe Power Sprint is important for my play style.  Spend only what is necessary to achieve proficiency in your chosen path .  I use points in Energy Armor to get there because it pays better than Kinetic Armor per point.  Assault Armor is already padded with extra Kinetic resistance as you will see in Figure 5.  Choosing Energy Armor for these points shores up what the armor lacks so its an easy choice.





Figure 3.  26 Skill points used

Bounty Hunting Options Tree:
The timing and use of the skills in the Bounty Hunting Tree are going to determine the outcome of the majority of your hunts.  The Shields line is mandatory if you want to extend your viability against a well prepared mark.  You will see I avoid putting points in Advanced Armor Break(AAB) and Manhunter boxes.  I skip Manhunter because 4 skill points is too much to pay for +5 Critical Chance.  I stick the AAB point into Ambush Intensity effectively doubling its damage from 5 to 10. 

If you want the Prescience line in this build, you have to drop 2 points in Ambush Intensity and pull 1 point back from Energy Armor.  This leaves Ambush Intensity at 2 damage so you might as well drop it all together for Lethality(Cripple Damage 5) or Return Fire.  I just prefer the Ambush Damage for the Carbineer build.





Figure 4.  No BM points used

Beast Mastery Options Tree:
Honestly, I have never played a Bounty Hunter Beast Master.  It has never interested me & It really takes some practice.  The quality of your Beast matters as does the ailments it can contribute to the hunt.  When I have been hunted by a BHBM, I've never really been worried and just focus on the Bounty Hunter.  That being said, there were some BHBMs on the Live servers that were flat out frightening.  It can be very viable and I will leave it at that until more information makes its way to me.  Fleshing this out on Red Dwarf isn't something I will be doing personally.  There is a nice guide in the Beat Mastery Profession forum for BHBM's.



IV. Gear Options:

     Armor:

There are two skills that require the use of Assault Armor in the Bounty Specialization Tree, Melee Defense & Ranged Defense so you might as well use Assault Armor if you have either of them.  Assault Armor isn't required but those points invested down there are tough to swallow if you aren't wearing Assault Armor.  You can always equip Appearance Armor or Clothing over it if it isn't your favorite style. Assault Armor has base stats of 7k Kinetic, 6k Elements & 5k Energy Defenses.

Some Hunters will stack the same 3 attributes across the board for instance, Precision, Constitution & Agility are common for Bounty Hunters.  I like to mix it up a little bit for some flavor.  I find Strength to be more favorable in my build and play-style for the To Hit% increase instead of Luck and find room for some in my suit.  I focus mainly on Agility and Precision for this Carbineer build.

Figure 5.  Assault Armor Leggings


7 pieces of armor can have Basic modifiers attached.  You can place Exotic or Basic modifiers on your Shirt, Breastplate and Weapon giving you a total of 10 upgrade-able pieces.  You can then add a Belt or a Personal Shield Generator(PSG).  The Test Center Frog does not have Socketed Belts at this time but I've included a looted belt below.

Leggings, Helmet, Gloves = +35 Agility, +35 Constitution, +35 Precision
Left Bracer, Right Bracer = +35 Agility, +35 Strength, +35 Precision
Left Bicep, Right Bicep = +35 Agility, +35 Luck, +35 Precision

Shirt, Breastplate = +3 Carbine ACR, +3 Carbine Critical Chance, +2 Carbine Damage

Looted Belt = +24 Precision, +17 Luck Belt

Rucksack of the Tuskan King Backpack = +25 Agility, +30 Constitution, +25 Luck, +35 Precision, +30 Stamina, +35 Strength

Armor Totals
+270 Agility, +304 Precision, +135 Constitution, +105 Strength, +112 Luck
+6 Carbine Action Cost Reduction, +6 Carbine Critical Chance, +4 Carbine Damage



     Weapons:

The Master Crafted EE3 Carbine was by far my favorite weapon on Live.  It is my go-to weapon of choice for the Heat\Fire DoT, audible report satisfaction & red bolt!  You can see the same Exotic modifiers that was used in the Breastplate and Shirt, also being used in the Carbine.    The visual result for an exotic total: 

+9 Carbine Action Cost Reduction, +10 Carbine Critical Chance**, +6 Carbine Damage

**Carbine Critical Chance is actually a 4 in the weapon instead of 3.  I still need to figure out if this is by design or if it actually measures 4 in Skill Mods.

Figure 6. Master Crafted EE3 Carbine


     Power Ups(PUPs):

In this particular build, I'm using two +5 Carbine Damage PUPs and one +7% PVP Critical Chance PUP.  In PVE, use all +5 Carbine Damage PUPS.  Feel free to play around with PUP selection but I would recommend sticking to offensive PUPs for Carbineers. 


     Heroic Jewelry:

Am a fan of the Heroism Set against every class except Dark Jedi. (+150 to each Attribute)
When hunting Dark Jedi, use Dire Fate Set and pray.
Enforcers Set isn't necessary in this build for player hunting.  It is great for PVE though.
Flawless Set isn't without its flaws and I just prefer the attribute buffs from Heroism Set.

     Entertainer Buff

Sometimes I mix & match but generally stick to the below.  I go back and forth with 6 points in the Defensive buff for Go with the Flow because everyone has snares, Sub out those 6 points to fill up your armor and pick up Constitution or Precision if you prefer.

 General:                                        Offensive:                                Defensive:                                   
+150 Strength                       + 150 Precision                         +150 Agility
+150 Precision              OR     +7% Critical Chance          OR   + 15% Movement Speed
+150 Agility                           +9% Action Cost Reduction       +3000 Kinetic Armor
+3750 of situational armor      +3750 of situational armor        +3750 Energy Armor



This is a snapshot of where this build goes (with TC Frog Buffs)
Figure 7.  All Buffed and ready to Hunt Stats

Figure 8.  All Buffed and ready to Hunt Skill Mods



V. General Strategy Options:

Traps use a ton of action.  Use them sparingly and wisely such as, when you've been snared yourself and the mark is approaching you instead of blindly dropping them and trying to lead them into one.  If you burn all that Action, you want it to count for something.  I personally try to avoid using traps at all with the Heroism Set.

Timing your Shields can make or break most hunts.  Most people will Line of Sight you when you pop Shields Up and if they are able to do that, chances are good you are going to lose if they are capable of high damage bursts (DJ, Pistol Whip Smugglers & Spys).  The best time to use it is when you believe they are coming in to finish off the last 3rd of your health.  If they are not low also, you could be in trouble.  If they keep attacking, great!.  If they disengage, use this window to heal up, identify possible escape or flanking maneuvers and to reset your own engagement distance.

Dread Strike is phenomenal.  Use it early when their main volley of attacks are coming and in many hunts you will get a 2nd shot with it after your Shields have expired.  Don't use it if your shields are up or if you are out of their damage dealing range.  Dread strike is great for creating a lull in their damage output and will often give you enough time for your own healing cooldown timers to reset.

Stim Heal before using your Skill Heal.  This will save you some Action upfront & stims have faster cooldowns.  As soon as your health is again low enough for your Skill Heal to fill you up, use it.  Keep your health high as long as you can in the early fight.  Try to juggle your Stim Heal and Skill Heal cooldowns if possible rather than using both at the same time.

Assault should always be on cooldown.  No reason for that skill to be idle in this build

Armor Break them to at least a 3-4 stack.  You can get it to a 5 stack easily when you hit Relentless Onslaught and maintaining a 5 stack without RO can eventually limit your Action options for other skills.

Relentless Onslaught... you will get this once per fight for the most part, like Shields.  Use it when you know you can do the most damage.  My favorite time to use it is when my Shields are wearing down and the mark is re-approaching.  Use every single skill you have while it is active as many times as you can if it can be done effectively.

If I see them blow a ton of Action, I will fire Intimidate Shot to sap even more... other wise I try to save it like an ace up my sleeve.  Many times I've heard, "I was just waiting for a little more action to heal" at the end of the fight. ;)

Cripple Shot is your snare.  I use it but I don't over due it.  Use it to re-establish the distance you want to fight at or to prevent the mark from rounding a corner to LOS you.  If you are using it for damage all the time, it might not be there when you need its snare properties but at the same time, it isn't that dependable in this build.
 



VI. Class Specific Strategy Options:


     Vs. Commandos

You want to spam Armor Break against Commandos because you will need it when they use Stand Fast.  I have had success by not dragging this fight out. 

It is best not to kite them, rather go toe to toe; all or nothing.  They will win the drag out kite game nearly every single time because of the DoTs they have.  They will Root themselves and your world will go dark.  Stay on top of your cooldowns.  If the Commando tries to kite you, don't let them break LoS.

The DotS will get the best of you if the Commando can drag out the fight.  Without a Serpent Shard, it is hard to win but not impossible.  Even if you win, you will limp away from this battle wondering how you didn't go down first.

 



     Vs. Dark Jedi

Change things up a bit.  Switch to Dire Fate Set.  Drop Armor and Strength in your Entertainer buff and get Go with the Flow, +150 Agility, +7% Critical Chance.  Use this movement speed to keep them out of range as long as possible but be aware they may flee and then try to double back on you to close the range.

Open up on them hard at a decent range and when you see them use Saber Block, go a bit easier on your Action pool.  Their two big attacks, Maelstrom & Force Drain bypass your armor so you will start taking damage quickly, to the tune of 7k+ Crits.  They are trying to get you to pop Shields so they can Force Run and LOS you till Shields expire.  You want to Dire Root them right at this time and prevent that.

Their Saber Block will be going on cooldown soon or right around this time depending on how your opening salvo went.  If they panic and hit Saber Block right away in order to close distance on you, perfect.  If you did not cause them to panic and hit Saber Block right away, you will need some fancy foot work to get it out of them in order to time your Dire Fate bait.  If it procs, you should be able to end it there.  If it doesn't proc, hit Power Sprint and chase them down.

Saber Block lasts for 40 seconds and it is on a 60 second cooldown so you have a small 20 second window to punish them.       





     Vs. Light Jedi

The Light Side Jedi typically won't run out of Action, no need to use Intimidate here.  Unlike Dark Jedi, Light Jedi depend on Melee range for their primary damage output & have the same 40 second Saber Block on a 60 second timer plus... a Saber Reflect Skill.  In your Entertainer Buff, You will want 7% Critical Chance, 9% ACR, 3750 Energy Armor & +150 Precision.

You want to stop auto-attacks when you see Saber Reflect On but you may want to still use some Special attacks like Armor Break or Cripple Shot to create space.  Time your Relentless Onslaught for right after you see Saber Block expiring but be careful about Saber Reflect popping up.  Some Jedi juggle these skills while some will use both at same time.

They will attempt to stick to you like glue when Saber Block is active.  Don't use your Power Sprint until they use Force Run.  Like Dark Jedi, they will want to force your Shields so they can LoS and then double back on you.  They have a good chance at doing this 1 Vs. 1 and are sometimes sturdy enough to just face you down during Shields without the LoS tactic.

Dire Fate set can be handy here but these Jedi aren't as squishy as their Dark Jedi brothers and sisters.  Don't expect to finish the fight with the Dark Jedi strategy above because of Dire Fate, unless they messed up their SBlock\SReflect\Heal timers.

Your advantage is Distance and you need to use it to wear them down.  A few good Crits when SBlock\SReflect are down can make all the difference.  I don't often expect to win this 1 Vs.1 without significant buff or situational advantages.





     Vs. Smuggler

Don't underestimate the capabilities of a good Smuggler.  I've never had one use Shoot First on me but you might want to keep in mind, you might already be TEF'd to them if they are aware of their bounty status.

Best advice is to maintain your distance if possible.  Most Smugglers will have Pistol Whip and need melee range to activate it.  They can also have Narrow Escape, most do, which allows them to break snare and become immune to it for an amount of time.  If they attempt to close on you in this manner, get your Dread Strike and Intimidate Shot on them at 20M and brace for the hit.

You will likely become rooted or heavily snared or both.  Smugglers are very mobile like Officers and will use it to their advantage.  It will be difficult to control the kite of the fight once you have been snared, rooted or whip'd.  The Smuggler should have the advantage there so you will need a snare on your side that allows you to lay down some damage at 45M+ or so.

A nicely timed Intimidate Shot can save your butt and possibly win you this fight, near the end.   





     Vs. Spy

This is a tough nut to crack without a lot of help from other Bounty Hunters or if in a PvP zone, Jedi can use Sense Danger to help reveal them or even better another Spy with Reveal Shadows Line.  If you show up to the Seeker Droid waypoint and they are not there, good luck.

If they allow you to agro or TEF them, you may have a shot but it could also be that they just want to +Stealth+ and then FlashBang+Ambush you on their terms.  You can quickly become the hunted, and often are.  Binoculars help but you really need them to mess up in order to win.  The Spy has every positional advantage over you and will likely only lose to you by taking chances against their Camouflage suit.

Their strength lies in their skill shots so you want to get Dread Strike off ASAP.  If they miss the big opening Crit on you, they may just use Without a Trace, move away and ITV out.  If they forced you to use your shields and you lived, you will die if you do not leave immediately.  Many Bounty Hunters will just drop Spy bounties and move on.





     Vs. Officer

Not to take away anything from Officer, but this will be one of the easier marks to take down.  The element of surprise combined with the relative squishy-ness of the Officer class should allow you to finish this one quickly.

They were not given the tools for this type of encounter.  If the Officer is aware of your intentions, it could get interesting due to their huge DPS spike capability and maneuverability.  I will usually open with Relentless Onslaught and attempt to maintain Burn distance keeping in mind, they are better at crowd control\deciding the encounter range, their pistol has a Range passed your Burn Skill & they may attempt to flee.

They are capable of removing debuffs(Fire DoT & Dread) and have a few Bleeds in store for you if this drags out.





     Vs. Bounty Hunter

In this mirror match, you want to make the other Bounty Hunter use Shields before you do.  This goal alone will shift advantage to you.  As soon as you see those shields, stop your auto-attacks.  You more than likely will be popping your shields right after theirs out of necessity so make note of how much time you will have Shields when theirs are down.

You will want to use Dread Strike right as your shields go down since they will have gained Action to burn and they will likely be waiting for your shields to go down to use it.  If they are using traps, hit them with Intimidate Shot.  There will be a war of attrition in the Action department and you should win if you are not dropping traps.





     Vs. Medic

This can be one of the greatest 1 Vs. 1 fights you will ever encounter.  Some of the best hunts I've ever had, win or lose, have been against Medics.  Even with surprise on your side, the Medic has the ability to slow the fight down to their speed.  They have what seems like every tool they need to draw out a fight against a Bounty Hunter.  If the Medic has Action left, the fight isn't over.

Open with Intimidate Shot and stay on it whenever it is up.  You will have to attack both pools and by that I mean, you will have to take shots to the face and run into some poo clouds.  In other words, you need the Medic to use some of that Action pool on their non-healing skills.  You will forget that they have Stasis at some point and nearly die because of it.  I've been in Medic fights where Shields became available again due to the extended skirmish.

Watching the debuffs on you has never been more important.  Rheumatic Calamity will punish you for using your Action pool and is quite deadly.  You will no doubt have Action pool issues, hopefully the Medic does also.  There is no guarantee in this match.  Medics are pretty tough, but fun.

This is a fight you will have to kite and control LoS but too much of it will only allow crucial Medic cooldowns to reset.






Work in Progress



 
« Last Edit: 22-02-17, 23:16:03 by creditfarmer »
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Offline creditfarmer

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #1 on: 02-02-17, 11:04:05 »
Reserved
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Offline riggs

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #2 on: 02-02-17, 12:09:52 »
This is nice, but stamina in gear is a waste for any class. And not using luck is a mistake, since it a) synergises extremely well with agility, and b) gives you all the offensive mods you need.

If you have action issues, get ACR in the ent buff. In fact, if you're using carbines, ACR synergises much better than a pure action pool because you get a negative action cost modifier when you use Reckless Onslaught.

That said, stamina may have a temporary use early in game before you start accruing buffs, et cetera. But then again, why waste materials/credits on something temporary?

Edit: You haven't mentionen gearing at this point, but since you claim stamina is by weight among the three most important stats, my argument remains. Luck synergises so well that it is impossible to place it after Stam, pre, str.
« Last Edit: 02-02-17, 13:01:48 by riggs »

Offline Decilation

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #3 on: 02-02-17, 13:59:13 »
Ohh, you're Sqeeto.
Mkay.

Guide looks good so far! In the future I recommend that you reserve at least 4-5 posts for guides, unless you're just going to keep adding to the first post. Which is also just as good :P -- I just like separating it by posts because I can link to sections.

In any case, I'm excited to see the rest of it! :)

Offline creditfarmer

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #4 on: 04-02-17, 01:31:46 »
Edit: You haven't mentionen gearing at this point, but since you claim stamina is by weight among the three most important stats, my argument remains. Luck synergises so well that it is impossible to place it after Stam, pre, str.

I'm not assigning importance to Stamina.  The profession allocates more of it Vs. other attributes is all.  Of the 360 Profession points, Stamina, Constitution and Agility get 240 of the 360 total.  So by weight @ 80 each, those are the primary Attributes, not necessarily the most important.  If you play a combat toon, the attributes that have the most influence on the combat system are obviously, the most important.
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Offline twotilmidnite

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #5 on: 04-02-17, 05:23:05 »
This has some very good points on it, though I question why you don't take the Prescience line. It's saved me many, MANY times between marks and being hunted. Imo it outweighs the extra Ambush damage.

Offline creditfarmer

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #6 on: 04-02-17, 06:03:03 »
This has some very good points on it, though I question why you don't take the Prescience line. It's saved me many, MANY times between marks and being hunted. Imo it outweighs the extra Ambush damage.

It can be done but you have to give up 2 points in Ambush Intensity (damage) and steal one point back from Energy Armor in order to free up three points to grab Prescience.  I just prefer the Ambush damage for the Carbineer build.  In a Rifleman build, I totally would.
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Offline riggs

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #7 on: 04-02-17, 09:14:21 »
Edit: You haven't mentionen gearing at this point, but since you claim stamina is by weight among the three most important stats, my argument remains. Luck synergises so well that it is impossible to place it after Stam, pre, str.

I'm not assigning importance to Stamina.  The profession allocates more of it Vs. other attributes is all.  Of the 360 Profession points, Stamina, Constitution and Agility get 240 of the 360 total.  So by weight @ 80 each, those are the primary Attributes, not necessarily the most important.  If you play a combat toon, the attributes that have the most influence on the combat system are obviously, the most important.

Fair enough, perhaps an odd choice of words since, in theorycrafting, the higher stat weight, the more you want to stack it.
Still, not using luck I believe is a huge mistake. The only reason you have an acceptable dodge, strikethrough, and evasion without high luck is because TC buffs gives you these a plenty.

On that note, why spend 5 points for 150 prec instead of 7% straight crit in ent buff? The latter is way more crit than prec grants (since, on live, without TC buffs a low luck build means low strikethrough value therefore rendering the StC from prec not very useful), and is not subject to diminishing returns from overstacking pure numbers.
« Last Edit: 04-02-17, 09:29:05 by riggs »

Offline creditfarmer

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #8 on: 04-02-17, 11:08:57 »
You make a good point about the 5 points for 150 Precision Vs. 7% Crit.  It just might be a smarter choice but I really love having three attributes over the 1000 mark.  The 1000+ Precision is also helping my Block Chance by another ~5% and when paired with my strength, I get an abnormally high Block Chance for a BH.

All we have is Test Center to play with right now but even on Live I would routinely buff-whore out, just like this.  The only Buff on the Frog I would routinely be without on hunts is the Smuggled Buff.

I've played with Luck suits and have never been impressed by the return on investment for BH.  There is no Luck in our Expertise.  If Luck was in every piece of this suit, not counting exotic pieces, that would only add another 175 Luck points to my current total.  That doesn't even buy 1% of any of the Luck benefits.  Add +150 Luck into the Ent buff and finally you get to 1% to Dodge, 1.5% to ST Chance and 1% to Evasion Chance.  It is just not worth it for a BH to stack Luck.  Just hashing this out makes me realize anything more than 300 Luck on a BH is a waste.  It shouldn't be in the two pieces of Armor I have it in, to be honest.

« Last Edit: 04-02-17, 11:12:19 by creditfarmer »
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Offline riggs

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #9 on: 04-02-17, 11:30:53 »
But your block value is so low that it's hardly worth it. The chance alone doesn't really do you any good unless your value is high.

The issue with assuming TC buffs is not just that you "can whore out" on live - you are including officer buffs and muon gold which you won't be able to run on live when hunting alone. Aurilian crystal, too, will not be up at all times for another loss of crit (again making the ent buff just so much more appealing), and the synapse/bio crystals won't be there for some time too. Without officer buffs, for example, you will lose a lot of strikethrough value (32%!) and dodge, which luck brings to the table. Luck can be offset when buffed to the extreme but in reality you won't have officer buffs when solo hunting, and some of the TC buffs are pre-cu things that may or may not be added to the live game at a later stage.
My point is, it is perhaps not the best idea to conceptualise the build around a scenario you can not count on when push comes to shove.

I don't really see the appeal in having over 1k stats for the purpose of having over 1k.

Offline creditfarmer

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #10 on: 04-02-17, 12:56:41 »
This is Test Center.  This is what we have right now and what we are playing with.  Here are the screen grabs you asked for so we can see the hits you are talking about.  I removed buffs to just the ones you see in the picture below and then grabbed a skill mod and stat screeny.

Strikethrough Value means nothing if your Strikethrough chance is in the dirt.  Same with Evasion Value.  You simply can't count on something that procs only 6 times on auto attacks in a two minute duel(with Frog Buffs).  None of my skill shots got a Strikethrough in all three duels, with Frog buffs.  You need to stack 300 Luck for 0.01% Strikethrough Chance, 0.01% Dodge Chance, 0.01% Evasion Chance.  You simply are not going to sway this in your favor when Luck ROI for those are 0.0033% per 100 Luck.  This thread isn't intended to be some flex competition about this carbineer build.  If you want Luck in your BH armor suit, go for it.  I would much rather have any other attribute in my BH suit, including Stamina, to bring this full circle.

P.S. Your weapon hits like a Mack truck :D  I should of got a Kinetic Buff but I wanted to use the Ent buff above since I knew you were responding to this thread.  I will make another BH on my nest account and gear her up with a Max Luck focus and I'd love to do more testing with you.  This is Test Center after all.  See ya around!

 



 

« Last Edit: 12-02-17, 21:17:04 by creditfarmer »
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Offline twotilmidnite

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #11 on: 04-02-17, 20:27:22 »
This thread isn't intended to be some flex competition about this carbineer build.


There is a difference between flex competition and debating the pro's and con's of stat allocation. He's not saying his word is law and you MUST run luck, just offering suggestions. Personally, in this patch version for expertise, I don't run any luck either (Except the luck that's on the flawless set and maybe a little from ent buff). I do full con/pre/agi with two con/str/agi so I can get my to-hit chance up to 5% with my buffs. I might end up trying a luck build down the line. I do, however, run Flameout which makes up for some of the StC I lose from not having luck.

This is bound to happen on a class guide post. There's no completely right or completely wrong way to play. If it works for you, great, but there are alternatives, which Riggs is offering.

Offline civic

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #12 on: 04-02-17, 20:35:08 »
"+100 Constitution = +8 Health & +2 Action     +100 Stamina = +8 Action & +2 Health"
Might wanna fix that :p

Guide is cool though :)
I hope people write more in this section. I don't really find guides useful as a whole.. I've always done things my own way rather than listen to other people.
Not saying yours is, but I find a lot of information is wrong or subjective, but that's just me.. But I do however think they are good for the health of a forum and for people to use as a base before doing their own thing.

And I do agree with you in regards to Luck. Not just as a BH but in general it's a poor attribute to have, especially in PvP. The stat is too wide spread - it's hard to focus a strong min/max build when your using Luck over something like Precision and Agility.

Offline creditfarmer

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #13 on: 08-02-17, 20:53:49 »
"+100 Constitution = +8 Health & +2 Action     +100 Stamina = +8 Action & +2 Health"
Might wanna fix that :p

Guide is cool though :)
I hope people write more in this section. I don't really find guides useful as a whole.. I've always done things my own way rather than listen to other people.
Not saying yours is, but I find a lot of information is wrong or subjective...

So far, I've pulled attribute conversion numbers from MasterCosmos' charts so they may not be accurate for Red Dwarf.   I will give the numbers above, a test this week.  Got a luck suit built to test out too. 

As far as being subjective, yeah a little bit.  I'm not a reporter, just a dude playing some Bounty Hunter.  I tried to edit some of my bias that was sneaking in and will make efforts to do a little better.
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Offline civic

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #14 on: 08-02-17, 23:05:18 »
I meant that you put 100 Con = 8HP. I'm sure you know that it's 800 and just wrote a typo.

Yeah like I said, it's good that you took the time to write it and offer people advice - especially considering people will be coming back here perhaps a little rusty. I went a bit off topic I guess but yeah, nice one mate good job.

Offline creditfarmer

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #15 on: 08-02-17, 23:34:06 »
I meant that you put 100 Con = 8HP. I'm sure you know that it's 800 and just wrote a typo.

Ahh yes, Fixed!

I tested and the conversion is still good.  An Entertainer buff of +150 Constitution gave 1200 Health and 300 Action.  Same with Stamina, but flipped.  Combining both in the Ent buff +150 Constitution & +150 Stamina yielded 1500 Health/1500 Action.

I still need to test Agility, Precision, Strength and Luck conversions.
« Last Edit: 09-02-17, 23:41:48 by creditfarmer »
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Offline pinhead

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #16 on: 12-02-17, 10:58:27 »
Thanks for the guide man.  I am new to the game and it helped spell things out a bit.  The amount of buffs and stats is a bit overwhelming...

Is this build flexible for pve and pvp without changing skills in the tree? Just some stat tweaks with the diff heroic jewelry?

Offline civic

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #17 on: 12-02-17, 19:59:30 »
The main areas that are relevant to PvP vs PvE is CC and AOE.

Most bosses can't be CC'd, and AOE is crucial for clears. So taking CC sets and expertise isn't ideal.
PvE bosses usually don't miss either, and deliver devistating blows, so you want the hp and armour benefit over something like extra agility.

Something a lot of people don't consider is that a large HP pool ultimately means it's easier for your medic to heal you. By having a large pool you can be more assured that you won't die in case they make an error in healing you (we've all heard the "oh sorry I didn't notice" or "my CD's aren't up" excuse) but it also means you are helping their action pool as well as they don't have to burst heal you as much and a lot of their HoT's can be enough to keep you topped up, especially if you aren't tanking.

Self-heals aren't as important for PvE either as you always usually have a dedicated healer, which isn't always the case in PvP.
« Last Edit: 12-02-17, 20:03:43 by civic »

Offline civic

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #18 on: 12-02-17, 20:05:12 »
I meant that you put 100 Con = 8HP. I'm sure you know that it's 800 and just wrote a typo.

Ahh yes, Fixed!

I tested and the conversion is still good.  An Entertainer buff of +150 Constitution gave 1200 Health and 300 Action.  Same with Stamina, but flipped.  Combining both in the Ent buff +150 Constitution & +150 Stamina yielded 1500 Health/1500 Action.

I still need to test Agility, Precision, Strength and Luck conversions.

AFAIK they are correct. Those numbers ring a bell and they make sence, just the 00's were missing from the HP and Action numbers that is all. Most likely a typo.

Offline creditfarmer

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Re: Bounty Hunter Options 101
« Reply #19 on: 12-02-17, 20:59:01 »
Is this build flexible for pve and pvp without changing skills in the tree? Just some stat tweaks with the diff heroic jewelry?

Yes.... but, I would add you can make a few changes to make PVE go a little smoother.  This build setup is primarily for hunting other players.

If PVE will be your focus, use Constitution, Precision & Agility in your suit.  Use Carbine Damage PUPs & use Enforcer's Heroic Jewelry Set.

In your Entertainer Buff, get +9% Action Cost Reduction, +150 Constitution, 15% Go with the Flow(Movement Speed) and +3000 situational Armor.  By situational I mean, get the defense for the attack type you will be encountering in PVE.  Sometimes it will be Energy based attacks(Death Watch Bunker), sometimes it will be Kinetic(Nightsisters\Krayt Dragon hunting).
« Last Edit: 12-02-17, 21:19:59 by creditfarmer »
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